Why have so many Western intellectuals been drawn to an examination of Zen?

Why have so many western intellectuals been drawn to an examination of zen?

They are feeling a great vacuum, and they want to fill the vacuum. You cannot live with a vacuum. The vacuum is empty, and out of that emptiness, life becomes sad, serious. All the religions have been filling your vacuum with lies. Now those lies are exposed. Science has done much in exposing those lies, and great meditators, mystics, have done tremendous work around the world in exposing all the lies of religions. The contemporary man stands in a strange position: the old has fallen, it was a deception, and the new has not yet arrived. So there is a gap, an interval, and the Western intelligentsia is trying to find something which will not be again a lie, which will not just give you consolation, but which will transform you, which will be a deep revolution in your very being. Zen certainly is the right approach towards existence, the…

Many years ago I enjoyed reading paul reps' book, `zen flesh, zen bones,' although it only gave me an intellectual understanding of zen. Since you have been talking on zen, I feel that not only have you conveyed to us the flesh and bones of zen, but in your silence you impart to us the very heart of zen. Is it the zen heart which western intellectuals are missing, and if so, why are they missing it?

The Western intelligence has taken a certain direction; there is no reason why. The Eastern intelligence has taken a totally different direction; there also, there is no reason why. Such is the case. The Western intellect has remained logical, rational, and has tried in every way to confine existence to reasonable terms, terms which mind can understand. The East has taken a totally different approach. What mind can understand is a very small part, and because it is only a small part, it is going to be dead, it is going to be material. That which is beyond mind has to be understood. The East has moved into the irrational, into the mystical, into the miraculous. And certainly, the Eastern approach is far wider, far bigger. It can contain the Western approach in it, but the Western approach cannot contain the Eastern. No-mind can contain mind, but mind cannot contain…

Osho, in lecture yesterday you spoke about the master's work: keeping his disciples from settling for less than "freedom from the self". In the west, much is made of the experience that "this is it," that nothing can be different than it is -- right now! Is this a copper mine experience? How can there be anything else?

I ALSO SAY THIS IS IT, but when I say this is it, it has a totally different meaning. It is not the same statement as it is being made in the West. The statement in itself has no meaning of its own; the meaning comes through your experience. Man can live on different planes. When Gautam the Buddha says "This is it!" he is using the same words as you use. The words are exactly the same and the dictionary meaning is the same, but the existential meaning is totally different; it may be even diametrically opposed to your meaning. In the West it has become fashionable to say that this is all, to live right now is all there is. But the people who are saying it have no idea of meditativeness, have no idea of absolute silence, thoughtless awareness, they have not experienced witnessing. Hence what they…

What factors do you attribute the western youth revolt to, and why are so many young people from the west now becoming interested in eastern religion and philosophy?

The whole attitude of modern youth is one of boredom with an empty affluence. The youth are leaving the society, and they will go on leaving it unless the whole society becomes poor. Then they will not be able to leave. This leaving, this renunciation, can exist only in an affluent society. If it is taken to an extreme, the society will decline. Then technology will not progress, and if this continues the West will become like the East is today. In the East they are turning to the other extreme. They will create a society just like that of the West. The East is turning to the West and the West is turning to the East, but the disease remains the same. As I see it, the disease is the imbalance, the acceptance of one thing and the denial of the other. We have never allowed the human mind…

All the religions are based on god. Their morality, their commandments, their prayers, their saintliness -- everything points towards god, and you say that god is dead. Then what will happen to all these great things that are dependent on the concept of god?

So Ma Tzu was a very strange man, perhaps there has never been another man so strange. A unique master in himself, he walked on all fours and always looked like a tiger. Whenever he looked at somebody, people started a deep trembling; he was a dangerous man. He was very healthy; he was bound to be, he was almost like a bull. Just the horns were missing, otherwise.... Between Ma Tzu on one side, Rinzai Zen, and Sekito on the other side, Soto Zen, Zen took flight; both were very powerful people, great masters. <q>AS A YOUNG BOY, SEKITO TOOK A STAND AGAINST AN OLD CUSTOM OF SACRIFICING A BULL AS A MEANS TO PLACATE EVIL SPIRITS; HE MADE A HABIT OF DESTROYING THE SHRINES DEVOTED TO SUCH SPIRITS, AND WOULD RELEASE BULLS FROM THEIR ENCLOSURES SO THEY COULD ESCAPE. AT THE AGE OF TWELVE, SEKITO MET MASTER ENO.…